king_leonides

The obvious follow-up question is this: Should Area G be broken up into 2 separate areas? They are sending nearly 40 bands to area finals. Should they be broken into 2 areas, so that their area contest does not last until 1 A.M. in the morning? Sheesh.

Thirty-eight. That is the grand total that will advance to 5A state finals. I don't know when the contest will start. But they can handle 4 bands per hour, approximately. (The judges have to take breaks. They are not robots, even though some scoring decisions make me wonder....) The prelim contest will likely need to start sometime at about 7 A.M. and run through 5 P.M. Then finals will start that evening. There needs to be a break between prelims and finals, if anything just to clear out the building, and re-seat the patrons. Plus I am sure the judges and officials need some dinner. Ten bands make finals. Add in retreat, and the show should wrap up at about 10:30 or 11 P.M., assuming that everything goes according to plan. If there are any delays or scoring disputes, then this could easily go past midnight. I really think UIL should consider scrapping the prelims/finals format, if they are going to have this high number of bands at finals. (p.s., think this is tough? This is effectively what Area G did, to host their area competition. It didn't wrap until after midnight as well.)

I guess you were right, and I was wrong. They didn't make state finals. They actually did not make area finals. Really strange. Really weird. This area competitions are tough, but some of the results tonight are head-scratchers. Seriously. They did have a brutal time slot, performing at 8 A.M. this morning. The Berry Center was freezing; it might has well have been an ice box, given the conditions.

hmmm....very interesting. Well, that's 1 spot from Area E that's locked up. The only way that they don't qualify for state out of that area, is if the bus breaks down on the way to the show.... That means 3 spots for the rest of KISD, CFISD, and FBISD schools to scratch and claw over. As always, that show at the Berry Center will be brutal.

And yet: The Indiana State School Music Association manages to hold the championships in all classifications in all years; The Ohio Music Educators Association does the same; The Michigan Competing Band Association does the same; Florida Marching Band Tournament - the same; Kentucky State Marching Band Championships - the same; Western Band Association (the California circuit) - the same..... Do I need to go on? These are not small states. I am sure the parents and students in these states face the same obstacles that we in Texas do. Yet they manage to hold a championship in each class ever year, year in and year out. I don't think anyone in those states are complaining. They also manage to hold concert and solo/ensemble contests each and every year, so that is not an obstacle. And I really will open a can of worms here: many of these state stage their championships in more expensive (dare I say better) venues. The Indiana championship is held in Lucas Oil Stadium, which is a much more modern location than the Alamodome. The Michigan championships are held at Ford Field, which is where the NFL franchise in Detroit plays. I am sure it costs a pretty penny to hold the events at these locations, but the music educators find a way to pay the rent at these locations, each and every year.

I read through the explanation at the UIL website. What rubbish. "1. The cost of transporting bands to area and state was becoming excessive." Rubbish. More expensive than a trip to Indianapolis or St. Louis, or any of the other out-of-state locations that bands in this state compete at? Rubbish. "2. When bands went to area and state every year it was necessary to limit the number of bands that advanced from region to area." and "3. By going to an every other year format many more bands get to participate at the area level." Rubbish. The only reason that these limitations exist is because UIL insists on holding all their state championships at one venue, namely the Alamodome. If they have 5 separate championships, for 5 different classifications, at 5 different venues, then this entire problem goes away. "4. The every-other-year format is coordinated with the Texas Music Educators Association Honor Band Competition that identifies the outstanding high school concert bands in the state of Texas." Seriously? Do you really think that honor band or concert band competitions will have the same importance as marching band contests? Obviously, this isn't having the desired effect, UIL. Besides, are the top programs in this state incapable of preparing for both? Seriously? Can they not walk and chew gum at the same time? Rubbish. "5. Since the adoption of this format there have been three occasions that the every- other-year schedule has been subject to review. In each case the vast majority of directors and school administrators have reaffirmed their support of the alternating year format." Well, that I can believe. Then again, did you ask any students or parents for input on this decision? I didn't think so. I think you would get a very different opinion, if you asked those constituencies. (Of course, the parents pay for these programs, through their taxes and fees - why should their opinion count?) Let me offer my own point 6: The UIL marching contests cost money. They offer almost no revenue streams. The UIL can't sell the TV rights to Fox or other broadcasters, as they do with the athletic events. So to minimize costs, the UIL spends the least amount of money possible, while placating the school administrators and professional educators. We should be thankful for what we get....or maybe we should just walk away.

General effect should be an explicit and separate caption on the scoring sheets. It has been this way in DCI since the very beginning. That is essentially the reason why BOA uses it. It is used in the marching championships in most states, but not in Texas. Many states replicate the BOA scoring system verbatim for their state championships. For some reason, in Texas, we decide to do things differently. It makes little sense. Then again, it makes little sense having the same organization run your music contests as your football games. In most states, it is the state music educator association (their equivalent to the TMEA) who run the marching contests. But in Texas, the athletic association runs the marching contests. Does that make any sense? No, it doesn't. Do you really think that marching band is a priority for the UIL? Of course, they only hold the 5A championships once every 2 years now. That makes zero sense whatsoever. I know the reasons why - it is because the marching contests are a perennial money-loser for the UIL. But imagine if the UIL tried to implement the same policy in football? What if the 5A football championship was only held once every 2 years? People in this state would be furious. Naturally, UIL would pick the worst-sounding stadium in the state to host their most important contest. Yes, the Alamodome is centrally located, and I am sure that UIL gets a discounted rate at that place. But the acoustics and at that place are horrible, compared with other venues in this state (Cowboys Stadium, Reliant Arena, to name two). I have no idea why they keep going back there every year. Again, UIL makes no sense. Maybe that is why some schools like SFA have simply given up on UIL, and don't go to state, even if they could easily qualify. SFA could probably win the Area E contest, but they won't bother to go. What does the director at SFA know, that the rest of us don't? I really dislike UIL, and since the last of my children have graduated, I dislike them even more. Intensely. I really wish more band directors in this state would simply punch out of UIL, and focus on BOA/USBBA shows instead.

Will they be wearing all-black uniforms, with a red sash across them? Well, if you're going to copy a Phantom show, you picked a good one. And no one dies in that one. No one gets stabbed or speared or falls on their head.....

Of course, a good follow-on question may be this: are these innovations a good thing? Not all change is improvement. Are we really better off, because of the innovations? For example, do the soundboards really add to the audio experience? In some cases, perhaps. But in many cases, show designers have come to rely on them too heavily. I can think of several shows I have seen in recent years, where the soundboard effects have ruined the show. And props? I can think of several shows where the props have detracted from the show. They function as a giant distraction, and do not add to the overall experience. You look at the prop, and ask yourself: What the heck is that thing for? Then you spend the next 10 minutes debating this in your mind, while ignoring the rest of the show. Perhaps the best example of both of these problems would be Spirit's 2010 show. It relied heavily on both electronics and props. And it was unbearable. Hate to say it, but that was one of my least favorite DBC shows in recent years. It was a giant disappointment, from a corps that I have come to love over the years. And I can name several other examples, at both the band and drum corps levels, where this is true. In all fairness, there have been decent uses of electronics. I like the Cavalier's use of them in the 2010 show. I actually thought that was the best DBC show last year, but that wasn't the judge's opinion last August. Regardless, their electronics added to the show concept, rather than subtracted from it.

Buy the 1980 Finals instead - assuming it is still available. I don't know if DCI is still selling those videos, but if they are, buy those instead. The 1980 finals featured classic performances by BD, 27th, Spirit and Bridgemen. I would honestly rather watch any of those shows, than any drum corps show I have watched for the past 2 seasons.

This, of course, raises another deeper question: Why doesn't UIL sponsor a color guard contest, and winter line contest? If they are not going to judge (and recognize) these performers as a unit, during marching band season, then should they have these contests during the winter guard season? I know there is already a Texas color guard circuit. Maybe a UIL contest could complement that circuit. That way, the top guards and drum lines will get recognition. (And if a school does not have a color guard or drum line, they simply don't have to participate. No one gets left out, and no one is put at a disadvantage.)

You know, I listened again to the Buddy Rich bus tapes again tonight. Much of my old director's rants could have come directly from Buddy Rich....or vice versa. Mind you, our director could not use the same level of obscenities - it was a Catholic school, by the way. But the pure, outright anger was all there. To quote some of of Rich's statements: "Where is you pride? Where is your professionalism? How dare you play that way? How dare you play that way for me? I expect 110 percent perfection each and every time!" Honestly, that could have been recorded in my band hall, circa October 1980. (And to reiterate, I am not talking about the directors at Seven Lakes, where my son marches. I have spent plenty of nights in that band hall, and never heard anyting like that. I am talking about my experience 31 years ago. Seven Lakes didn't even exist then.)

I don't even think it was that, Xenon. His philosophy of life was simple: the world is made up of two classes of people: winners and losers. So don't end up on the wrong side of that line. He wanted to teach the young men in his program to be winners, bottom line. He really felt like he was doing the best for us. So to him, losing was absolutely intolerable and unacceptable. And to a large extent, he was right: many of the young men who went through that program turned out to be very successful in life. They have become businessmen, professionals, teachers, military officers - and even a few became professional musicans. Now, is this the right way to educate young people? Is this right way to prepare young musicians? I don't know. I simply know this: my experiences, during those 4 years in that band program, were among the most important in my life. They molded me into the person I am today. It left an indelible impression on my mind and soul. I really feel that it had a bigger impact on me, than my home life.

Should I start another thread, or respond here? I myself marched in a program where winning wasn't optional. It really was the sole focus of the program. And the band director made it clear to ever freshman, who walked in the door on the first day of school. He kept a picture of Vince Lombardi on the wall, in the director's office, with famous caption "Winning isn't everything...It's the only thing." He also kept books on her shelf behind his desk, from Woody Hayes and Bobby Knight. And he patterned much of his leadership style after Lombardi, Hayes, and Knight. And he ran an incredibly successful program. He won the Ohio state marching championship 8 times over his career. He won the National Cherry Festival 4 times, and he finished as high as second at Festival of States (the forerunner to BOA.) He transformed a small, Catholic, all-male high school band, with no tax dollars or community support, into a national powerhouse. He did it seemingly out of sheer determination and force of will; even his own administration didn't support him, most of the time. I entered that program in 1979, and the message to me was very clear: this program is about winning. It isn't about giving a good, entertaining performance, or learning valuable life-lessons. It was about winning. And if you weren't with the program - you were out. We lost a contest in the fall of 1980, finishing 3rd. We came into the band hall that evening, after the long ride home from Dayton. The director was, well, I will simfply put it this way - absolutely furious. Livid. Irate. I can remember portions of his tirade against us. He lambasted us, for embarrassing those who had gone before us. (If you've ever listened to the Buddy Rich bus tapes - well, look them up on Youtube. You will get a feel of what it was like, to be in that band hall, after a loss.) We had a bounceback year in 1981, winning the Cherry Festival in Michigan. But the fall 1982 was another poor season for us, and he cancelled our trip to Festival of States in Florida. We ended our senior year on a real downer. But I understood the director's motivation: he didn't want us ruining our reputation, by putting on a bad show at nationals. You see, with some people, winning really is everthing. And by winning, that means taking home the first place trophy. =========================================================================== Fast forward 30 years - my son is marching now. Needless to say, he is in a very different environment at his school. The directors at Seven Lakes are trying to build a successful program, and have done well so far. They are not a championship caliber band yet - although they are trying to get there. But I do think the directors and staff there are emphacizing the learning experiences, more than the winning, as they try to get to the next level. So I have seen my experiences - and I can compare them to those of my son. Which approach is best? That is a purely philosophical question, and honestly, even I am ambivalent about it now.

If you take that mentality, and design a show for BOA, you would get creamed. You would end up with virtually no scores in GE. You could still do well in visual and music education, but in general effect - you would get smoked. Since most of the top programs in Texas compete in BOA, they have to put on "Broadway productions", to use your terminology. What you saw the past 5 days at the Alamodone is, by and large, the result of the BOA/DCI/DCA scoring system, which weighs heavily on GE. We can debate all day about the merits of that scoring system, but until the scoring system changes, the shows won't. I personally think that some show designers have indeed gone too far, in order to earn GE points. I agree with you there. I think that GE should be part of the scoring sheets for all contests, including UIL. (Right now, it is included implicitly, not explicitly.) But can a show designer overdo it, in his attempt to win over the GE judges? Absolutely. And I think that is what you are concerned about.

During that era, the primary representative from Texas was SA Highlands. Here is their 1982 performance Again, another solid, quality performance of a traditional MB show. This one featured a great rendition of "La Suerte de los Tontos."

West Genesee's classic performance of Over The Rainbow, from the 1980 Festival of States competition, in St. Petersburg. They created a rainbow at the back of their show, by suspending balloons of various colors behind the far yard line. My HS band came down from Ohio, thinking we were going to win that contest in 1980 - easily. Boy, were we in for a shock......WG was the dominant program nationwide, in the late 70's/early 80's. And they proved that night who was #1 - it wasn't us. OK, maybe the effect was cheesy, and maybe the music and drill lacks the speed and complexity of modern shows. No, they didn't have any jazz running at 200 BPM. No, they didn't have 30 kids in the front ensemble. (Technically, they didn't have a front ensemble; every percussion instrument was carried, even the timpanis.) They still performed with great showmanship and enthusiasm, and that how is they won. Sadly, many of the great performances of that era have been lost. You can occasionally find videos of them on youtube, but I had to spend a whole week, trying to find this show alone. There's also a grainy, black-and-white video of Falls Church from this contest, but is poor quality. So many people today think that marching band began in 1984, with the first BOA show in Indianapolis. That is simply not true. There were great performances before then, and they shouldn't be ignored or forgotten.

Let's break down the numbers, folks. SLHS did rate 1 in marching, on judge 4's sheet, and and 8 on judge 5's sheet. That is obviously inconsistent. Judge 4 had a much smaller gap from 1-10, than judge 5. Judge 4 gave SHLS a score of 883, and Jersey Village, in 10th place, at 830. That's a difference of 50 points. By contrast, judge 5 gave Langham Creek an 885, and Cypress Creek a 782. Judge 5 was simply viewing much wider disparities in the competitors, than judge 4. I expect that judge 5 was probably much more critical on the sheets than judge 4. And this is probably the reason why these 2 judges were so inconsistent - not just on SLHS, but on LCHS and CWHS as well. Would SLHS have qualified for state, if judge 5 had given us a 1 instead? No. That would have given SLHS an ordinal of 28, and Cy Falls an ordinal of 24. Ultimately, it would have meant the same outcome - no trip to the Alamodome for the Spartans this year. Cy Falls had a raw score of 4321. SLHS had a raw score of 4117. So on a raw score basis, Cy Falls would have advanced. I have previously advocated in this board, for the elimination of ordinal systems. They skew results, by accentuating the differences between close competitors. But even that had happened last Friday, it would not have changed the outcome from last Saturday: Cy Falls goes to the Alamodome, and SLHS does not.

Here is a fun exercise. Go to Guidestar.com. Register for a free account. Then you can look up the IRS Form 990 for your band, winter guard, drum corps, or other unit. (This assumes that your organization is registered as a charity, under chapter 501C3 of the U.S. tax code. Most HS booster clubs will have this designation.) Guidestar puts out all this information to the general public. And some of it is shocking. I did an analysis last year for Drum Corps Planet, to determine why it costs so much to run some of the world-class corps. It is amazing what they lavishly spend money on. Anyway, regarding the designer and arranger fees: most units will not openly reveal how much they spend. But if you look closely at their 501C3s, you can decipher this. Some outfits are spending between $20,000 to $40,000 on the total fees. They generally lump these fees together, under "other professional services" in the tax return. That's likely the cost for the brass book, drum book, and drill design put together, in most cases. And, of course, some units keep the designers on retainer, so they can have changes made throughout the season. Now, does the average high school band pay this much? Generally, no. Designers will charge a much smaller fee to high schools. They charge the "Neiman Marcus" fees to the drum corps - hey, if they have to ask the price, then they can't afford it.

Technically, Area E is not West Houston. It just appears that way. Area E includes HISD, which stretches all the way east to the Ship Channel. It only seems like "West Houston", because quite frankly, the only bands that qualify for Area are for West Houston. The only HISD 5A band that has qualified for the past two years has been Westside, which ironically is from the west side of that school district. All the other qualifiers came from Fort Bend, Katy, Cy Fair, and Alief. (Waltrip also earned a 1, in 4A.) HISD should produce more than 2 bands with a 1 at regions. It is the largest school district in this state. But music education has languished badly in that district. There are numerous reasons behind this - and I am way too tired tonight, to branch off into that tangent.

I was just discussing that exact point in the Area E thread: http://www.txbands.com/forums/index.php?sh...c=3852&st=0

Umm... I marched in those shows, so I can tell you that they are no "myths." Did I state or imply that all 256 5A bands in this state should be at Finals? No, I did not. I gave this approach as a method to expand the number of bands that do make Finals in this state. It also open the way to have competitions at all 5 classifications in a single year. Where is it written that UIL needs to have the entire contest, for a particular class, on the same day? And at the same stadium? It says that nowhere. That is an artificial rule that UIL has created for itself.

Again, here is the schedule that Ohio uses - this is the example I cited earlier: http://www.davidsonbands.org/OMEA%20Docume...%20Schedule.pdf They 2 use different stadiums, and have the contests at both stadiums on 2 different weekends. (Of course, their stadiums do not have domes on them - but Ohio has no domes.) This gives them ample room to hold contest each year, in all 4 classifications in that state - AA, A, B and C. And with that schedule no bands perform in the morning - the earliest performance time is 12 P.M. The latest that any band peforms is 10 P.M. There is no preliminary competition - each band only performs once. And altogether, 115 bands perform at state finals this year, across all 3 classes. That's almost twice the number that will perform at UIL Finals, in a typical year. Should we adopt that schedule in Texas? Not necessarily. Are there aspects of this schedule that we should consider using? Definitely.

Thanks, Fortissimo. Yes, I have been watching your shows for 5 years now, and that was simply the best performance ever by that band. I think the program has tremendous upside. Let's hope that this year's underclassmen will get to see the Alamodome in 2012. I went back, and looked at some of the old videos of when I marched (before cell phones, literally. ) The precursor to Bands of America was Festival of States, which was held each year in St. Petersburg, Florida. In the 70's and early 80's, the best bands at Festival of States were Falls Church, from Virginia, and West Genessee, from New York. I compared the SLHS show from last night, to Falls Church's best show, from 1980, when they finsihed 4th in the nation. I honestly think SLHS show was better. The SLHS show had better percussion, and the drill was definitely more complex and demanding. Falls Church may have had more power, but SLHS had more balance. (Now Genesee was probably better than SLHS, but Genesee that was the equivalent to Avon today. They were untouchable.) Which segways back into my 2 original points from my earlier post: 1) Marching bands have improved dramatically in quality, over the past 30 years. There are a multitude of reasons behind this, so I won't list them here. 2) There are a lot of tremendous shows that will not be performed at state finals this year, which is really sad, at many levels. This makes it extremely hard for the judges to pick the 4-7 bands from each area, who get the priviledge of performing at state finals. That is perhaps the biggeste reason why the UIL should expand the opportunities, for bands to perform at the state level.

For the record, I do not disparage any of the bands that made state finals this year. I am sure that all of them worked very hard, and earned their spot at the Alamodome. I am sure that the marching members, parents and instructors at those schools worked very hard, and made great sacrifices as well. Congratulations to them. Am I disappointed at the results from yesterday? Of course. There are thousands of marchers, parents, and instructors all over this state, who are feeling disappointment today. The Spartans really, legitimately felt this was going to be their year, and unfortunately, it didn't happen. They did make the area finals this year for the first time, and quite frankly, that was an accomplishment, for a program that was literally non-existent, five years ago. This does give us hope and encouragement for the future. This points out the existential reality of marching band in this state. There are only about 30 spots up for grab at the 5A state finals. There's probably 2 to 3 times that number, who could legitimately lay claim to deserving a spot in the Alamodome. The breadth and depth of music programs in Texas is really incredible, when compared to other states. Unfortunately, you can't host a contest for 70, 80, 90 bands, in one stadium, in one day. It is physically impossible. Hence, unless the UIL changes its format for the state championship, there will always be bands who deserve to perform at the state level, but won't get the chance. Does the UIL need to seriously look at restructuring its championship, to give more bands an opportunity to perform at the state level? Perhaps. Ohio, for example, has their state championships at 2 separate stadiums, spread out over two weeks. http://www.davidsonbands.org/omea_main.html But that is a separate debate, and one that we will need to have some other time.....