2024 BOA Grand National Championships (Nov. 14-16)

[whitewing09]

Really wanna see Rouse at nats soon!

[tubapop]

BRIDGELAND kiddos!!! Phenomenal year, you are now officially a respected powerhouse!!! Congratulations!!! Now go catch up on all that missed schoolwork lol

 

[cheeto2401]

the recaps on musicforall are boa san antonio recaps lmao

[utee94]

Wow what a finish for CP, so proud of those kids, they really blew the roof off of Lucas Oil. 

Congrats to all the finalists, and all the participants all weekend, what a great time.

Now I can't wait for the 2025 show announcement in May... 😀

[jetliner]

HornRank's homepage is the finals results, for what that's worth

[Dallas Hobbs]

Wow Avon scored the same in semis and finals

[Dallas Hobbs]

Argyle finished 23rd, Friendswood finished 20th ❤️ 

[Whitephoenix461]

Honestly, I feel as though the judging is a little biased. As someone supporting the Prosper Texas Band, I was very excited when they received top 12 and moved onto finals. That being said, after seeing Castle High School’s show, I felt as though we sounded better. When results came, I was actually shocked that Castle got 9th while we got 11th. I’m not saying I’m not grateful to be in the top 12, but the fact that Castle is an Indiana Band which scored higher than us despite many people I know saying they sounded and looked worse than us, makes me a little fishy. Also, these bands all have great shows, I’m not saying they don’t, however the fact that Avon and Carmel have been in the top three for practically decades straight leads me to believe that the judging is baised towards the home bands. That being said, congratulations to any bands who made top 12 and congratulations Avon, for winning this years Grand Nationals.

Also, let me further reiterate that this is my educated opinion based on people I know and their experience with Marching Band and Grand nationals. I do not have any spite towards any of the higher ranking bands and I apologize if this statement does seem as though I do.

Edit: I also want to reiterate that I mean no disrespect towards any bands that have been apart of the BOA Grand Nationals. I am merely pointing out a trend in the results trending back to my parents participating in Grand Nationals and how, in *my opinion* that it is a tad bit unreasonable that the same ( mainly Indianapolis) bands haven’t had a bad year in decades and have consistently made top 5. I’m not saying it isn’t normal for a band to place around the same for years in a row, I just find it unlikely that there haven’t been any noticeable outside circumstances which have kept Carmel and Avon from the top. For example, the Prosper Band likely won’t go to nationals for a few years due to a new High school appearing and dividing their roster. I simply find the data somewhat unlikely considering the data most other bands have had.

Lastly, again, I don’t want to say that any bands don’t deserve their placement, ( especially sorry for the implied shade I may have thrown toward castle. ) And all of the bands which preformed were beautiful, regardless of placement.)

[whitewing09]

Can someone explain to me why cedar park music scores seem deflated? They (18.60) were .35 away from both bridgeland (18.25) and tarpon springs (18.95). Id assume execution wise they play a level closer to tarpon who was another .35 from the next band.

 

is it a musical demand issue? A design issue?

[tubapop]

3 minutes ago, Whitephoenix461 said:

Honestly, I feel as though the judging is a little rigged. As someone supporting the Prosper Texas Band, I was very excited when they received top 12 and moved onto finals. That being said, after seeing Castle High School’s show, I felt as though we sounded better. When results came, I was actually shocked that Castle got 9th while we got 11th. I’m not saying I’m not grateful to be in the top 12, but the fact that Castle is an Indiana Band which scored higher than us despite many people I know saying they sounded and looked worse than us, makes me a little fishy. Also, these bands all have great shows, I’m not saying they don’t, however the fact that Avon and Carmel have been in the top three for practically decades straight leads me to believe that the judging is baised towards the home bands. That being said, congratulations to any bands who made top 12 and congratulations Avon, for winning this years Grand Nationals.

 

Your immediate instinct when “losing” shouldn’t be to cast doubt on the judges’ integrity just because it’s a result you didn’t like, with zero evidence. It’s a bad look. Maybe look on here and Hornrank to see what most people saw, which is that Castle turned in a better performance than Prosper. 

[tubapop]

Just now, whitewing09 said:

Can someone explain to me why cedar park music scores seem deflated? They (18.60) were .35 away from both bridgeland (18.25) and tarpon springs (18.95). Id assume execution wise they play a level closer to tarpon who was another .35 from the next band.

 

is it a musical demand issue? A design issue?

My guess is demand. A lot of big beautiful chords but I don’t remember much complexity. But I could be remembering wrong 

[ClarinetKing]

5 minutes ago, Whitephoenix461 said:

Honestly, I feel as though the judging is a little rigged. As someone supporting the Prosper Texas Band, I was very excited when they received top 12 and moved onto finals. That being said, after seeing Castle High School’s show, I felt as though we sounded better. When results came, I was actually shocked that Castle got 9th while we got 11th. I’m not saying I’m not grateful to be in the top 12, but the fact that Castle is an Indiana Band which scored higher than us despite many people I know saying they sounded and looked worse than us, makes me a little fishy. Also, these bands all have great shows, I’m not saying they don’t, however the fact that Avon and Carmel have been in the top three for practically decades straight leads me to believe that the judging is baised towards the home bands. That being said, congratulations to any bands who made top 12 and congratulations Avon, for winning this years Grand Nationals.

 

While I respect your opinion, you might also consider that Avon and Carmel have been 2 of the highest achieving programs in the country for 20 years give or take and the judging accurately reflects this. If Hebron, Vandegrift, and Flower Mound regularly attended this contest then they would consistently be top 5 as well. The judges are well seasoned in the marching arts and properly trained in effective and fair judging techniques specifically for this activity. 
 

BOA judging is not so much achievement based like UIL is though, so while one band may objectively look or sound better as a whole it doesn’t necessarily mean they will place higher in a BOA system. A lot of the scoring has to do with effective show writing like how the visual aspect of the show outlines each musical moment and such. There are much deeper explorations of content and design in BOA judging that you won’t find in UIL judging as often.

On a side note in regards to Prosper, you can see just how competitive Texas band is compared to the rest of the country. While prosper fell just short of state finals they managed to snag a spot in Grand National Finals for the 3rd time. This is so mind blowing. We love our Texas bands! 

[tubapop]

One more thing, Bridgeland kiddos. You might get a kick out of knowing that in semifinals, your visual ensemble score was second only to Avon. You beat Carmel, Broken Arrow, Tarpon Springs and all the rest. Your total visual score in semis was #4 behind Avon, Carmel and Broken Arrow. Nice work. 

[tubapop]

13 minutes ago, ClarinetKing said:

While I respect your opinion, you might also consider that Avon and Carmel have been 2 of the highest achieving programs in the country for 20 years give or take and the judging accurately reflects this. If Hebron, Vandegrift, and Flower Mound regularly attended this contest then they would consistently be top 5 as well. The judges are well seasoned in the marching arts and properly trained in effective and fair judging techniques specifically for this activity. 
 

BOA judging is not so much achievement based like UIL is though, so while one band may objectively look or sound better as a whole it doesn’t necessarily mean they will place higher in a BOA system. A lot of the scoring has to do with effective show writing like how the visual aspect of the show outlines each musical moment and such. There are much deeper explorations of content and design in BOA judging that you won’t find in UIL judging as often.

On a side note in regards to Prosper, you can see just how competitive Texas band is compared to the rest of the country. While prosper fell just short of state finals they managed to snag a spot in Grand National Finals for the 3rd time. This is so mind blowing. We love our Texas bands! 

Just curious, why should a band have to attend a contest regularly to win it? 

[jetliner]

31 minutes ago, tubapop said:

One more thing, Bridgeland kiddos. You might get a kick out of knowing that in semifinals, your visual ensemble score was second only to Avon. You beat Carmel, Broken Arrow, Tarpon Springs and all the rest. Your total visual ensemble score in semis was #4 behind Avon, Carmel and Broken Arrow. Nice work. 

Do not look at that same caption in prelims lol

[Hard Core Band Fan]

19 minutes ago, tubapop said:

Just curious, why should a band have to attend a contest regularly to win it? 

They wouldn't, but being a 20 to 30-minute bus ride away from this competition and getting to compete at it every year can help to raise the level of your band, if that is what you would like to do. You still have to do the work, of course, but having this opportunity every year can indeed help you to achieve this level. Neither Avon nor Carmel started at this level and had to claw their way to the top.

[tubapop]

12 minutes ago, jetliner said:

Do not look at that same caption in prelims lol

lol I know. Crazy variation in scores 

[Tubalord11]

Hey everyone!! So just got home and the video wasn’t there so just took a look. Congrats to Avon, no surprises!! Was a little shocked at Leander in 12th, but other than that nothing to shocking, happy to see Bridgeland 7th and AF 8th. Congratulations again to everyone on their season!!’ Can’t believe it’s already over, but I can’t wait for WGI!! Good night! 

[tubapop]

Now that the marching season is over, if anyone has tips on how to stop compulsively checking this site, I'd appreciate them. Only half joking lol.

[lost]

9 hours ago, tubapop said:

Just curious, why should a band have to attend a contest regularly to win it? 

Vandegrift literally won on their first try.

[lost]

9 hours ago, Whitephoenix461 said:

Honestly, I feel as though the judging is a little biased. As someone supporting the Prosper Texas Band, I was very excited when they received top 12 and moved onto finals. That being said, after seeing Castle High School’s show, I felt as though we sounded better. When results came, I was actually shocked that Castle got 9th while we got 11th. I’m not saying I’m not grateful to be in the top 12, but the fact that Castle is an Indiana Band which scored higher than us despite many people I know saying they sounded and looked worse than us, makes me a little fishy. Also, these bands all have great shows, I’m not saying they don’t, however the fact that Avon and Carmel have been in the top three for practically decades straight leads me to believe that the judging is baised towards the home bands. That being said, congratulations to any bands who made top 12 and congratulations Avon, for winning this years Grand Nationals.

Also, let me further reiterate that this is my educated opinion based on people I know and their experience with Marching Band and Grand nationals. I do not have any spite towards any of the higher ranking bands and I apologize if this statement does seem as though I do.

There is no bias for Indiana bands. Think about this bigger in scope, why would MFA or these judges be “biased for the home bands”. There’s no connection between those programs and MFA that’s different than any other in the program. You can’t just yell bias when the result isn’t what you want.

All respect people are telling you you looked and sounded better out of politeness most likely. Even then it’s difficult to judge as a spectator when you’re not in the box or on the field hearing and seeing what the judges are.

[TheSV-001Gamer]

Who recorded all our finalists?

[utee94]

I'll add the same thing I've pointed out before on other threads, I think some Texas band fans become accustomed to the UIL score sheets and metrics, and expect BOA to be scored in the same way.  And, it's just not.

Some folks prefer the UIL scoresheets and some folks prefer the BOA scoresheets but either way, when you attend a BOA event, you know how it's going to be scored.  There's no sense in complaining about it, everyone knows ahead of time what the deal is.

 

[TheSV-001Gamer]

What if instead of like overall scores, or placements.

It was like, who has the biggest props?? 

[whitewing09]

1 hour ago, utee94 said:

I'll add the same thing I've pointed out before on other threads, I think some Texas band fans become accustomed to the UIL score sheets and metrics, and expect BOA to be scored in the same way.  And, it's just not.

Some folks prefer the UIL scoresheets and some folks prefer the BOA scoresheets but either way, when you attend a BOA event, you know how it's going to be scored.  There's no sense in complaining about it, everyone knows ahead of time what the deal is.

 

Very much this. I think it also goes beyond scored sheets, but also just culture around performing arts. I have a vague recollection that at one point many years ago on this forum, some made contrasts in how Texas bands sound vs other states. Something to the tune of Texas bands focusing on timbre, tone quality, ensemble balance, whereas many non-Texas bands focus on phrasing and technical precision. Nowadays I think top bands are playing at such a level of execution that the differences aren’t as stark, but last Saturday I did find myself saying, “wow I think this Vandegrift show would score better at nats than San Antonio,” before placements were even announced. And I find it telling that only time Avon has placed below 3rd in the past decade was when they came to Texas regional (obvi more factors at play too).

I also find it funny that for years there’s been a running joke that BOA judges hear with their eyes because of the perceived higher correlation between visual demand and MGE scores than musical demand and MGE scores.  I think that analysis would be a fun data project to take on 😂