2018 6A State

[Samuel Culper]

Hello there. I'm new to this forum and had to create an account so I could chime in.

 

Let's not get (1) "The ability to put together winner shows year by year is far from boring" confused with (2) performing a winning show created by someone else.

 

This year, no doubt, Vista Ridge was the hottest band on the circuit. They brought it - hands down. They were, BY FAR, the most improved band in the state - culminating with the 6A state win.

 

But lets remember where show themes come from. They are either (1) original - completely original or somewhat original or (2) a rehashed version of someone else's originality.

 

VR's show was very tightly copied from Hendrickson's 2015 "Lost" - from the spinning compass right down to Amazing Grace. Not to mention the version of "Lost" the Boston Crusader's did in 2018 - again, right down to Amazing Grace.

 

Great ideas never die away, they just get recycled - or in some cases sold to other bands to redo on their own.

 

VR marched their socks off - don't get me wrong, it was spectacular. I am not hating on VR. I loved their show each time I saw it.

 

But to put those bands in the same category as bands who create winning shows year after year is a stretch. Let's not forget VR's 2017 sled dog race show. Just an overall bad idea.

 

Having the creativity to come up with a great fresh show idea every year is a rare talent - most bands don't have that luxury.

 

If you want to see a recent example of bands buying/stealing/reusing someone's else's originality, take a look at Hendrickson's 2017 show "Just Another Brick". This show was highly original and creative.

 

Go to You Tube and search "2018 high school band just another brick" and see how many high schools took Hendrickson's originality and recycled it just 1 year later.

 

On the alter of originality, I must confess that someone told me about the "brick" story - so it wasn't originality on my part. I just thought it was a perfect story for my post.

 

Thanks for letting me chime in.

 

I honestly have no idea what your point is here within the context of this thread, if not to take a crack at VR. (See your "hating" comment on the Iditarod show)

 

If you think that there should be some scoring difference for shows based on "originality", I think you could start a pretty lengthy discussion on that topic.  Again, why bring it up on this thread?  

[principalagent]

Are we really going to act like “lost and found” as a show concept, of ALL THE PLAYED OUT SHOW CONCEPTS, just magically showed up in 2015? Literally that theme is third to planets/space and America.

 

Pretty much none of these themes are original. Some band has done basically everything before. Even the ones you think are new, truly aren’t. There was more than one “brick” show in San Antonio finals in 2017.

 

Let Vista Ridge have their things in peace.

 

Also Iditarod slaps and nobody else can tell me different. The Battle on the Ice segment was one of my favorite moments of 2017 and please, everyone @ me about it.

[LeanderMomma]

Are we really going to act like “lost and found” as a show concept, of ALL THE PLAYED OUT SHOW CONCEPTS, just magically showed up in 2015? Literally that theme is third to planets/space and America.

 

Pretty much none of these themes are original. Some band has done basically everything before. Even the ones you think are new, truly aren’t. There was more than one “brick” show in San Antonio finals in 2017.

 

Let Vista Ridge have their things in peace.

 

Also Iditarod slaps and nobody else can tell me different. The Battle on the Ice segment was one of my favorite moments of 2017 and please, everyone @ me about it.

I thought Iditarod was an excellent show as well, and it certainly started the rise of Vista Ridge to the upper ranks that they enjoyed this year. They made finals at BOA DFW with that show in 2017, and did so with a VERY early report time after driving through the night after a football game. We knew last year that Vista was trending upward fast and they didn’t disappoint.

 

I’m not sure what the original poster’s intent is either. Perhaps a miffed Hendrickson student/parent? I hope not because I really respect Hendrickson.

[Rudedog34]

I don't believe the poster is hating on VR, at least I hope not. Especially if they are associated with Henny.

 

I think the poster is expressing their preference for original, new designs and music to go with it. VR blew the doors off with musicality and marching in 2018 and the poster conveys that. VR earned the accolades and well deserved.

 

As for Avon and Henny's "Brick" shows...2 totally different and original concepts.

 

Yes, with Gunderson & Duffy on staff at Henny they have had original and fresh designs and music to accommodate the shows. Unraveled, Lost, 3D, Just Another Brick. I would include Blueprints For Life, but from what I undertstand, it wasn't the 2018 show that was to be performed. I was told the original 2018 show was substituted with Blueprints when Gunderson and Duffy left the program.

 

Gunderson is now at Bowie. Duffy at D' Springs, is contracted to work with Henny through '19 I believe, but in what capacity? How original and new Henny's shows will be in the future will be determined by the vision of the new staff. They're young and hungry, BTW. I personally hope they keep with the Hawk trend and don't use recycled content. It's what makes them unique.

[abtwitch]

 

But to put those bands in the same category as bands who create winning shows year after year is a stretch. Let's not forget VR's 2017 sled dog race show. Just an overall bad idea.

 

If you want to see a recent example of bands buying/stealing/reusing someone's else's originality, take a look at Hendrickson's 2017 show "Just Another Brick". This show was highly original and creative.

 

Go to You Tube and search "2018 high school band just another brick" and see how many high schools took Hendrickson's originality and recycled it just 1 year later.

 

One of my good friends graduated from one of the high schools that "stole" Just Another Brick, they have nothing but respect for the band whose show they bought. In reality, the show designer probably put it up for sale and the band in question bought it because they can't afford their own show design team. North Lamar has used Tarpon Springs shows for a while now and are probably the strongest 4A band in the state (yes, I disagree with this years results, but that's another rabbit hole I'm not going into in this thread). Buying shows and playing them is not a new concept and was in no way a targeted attack at Hendrickson.

 

Also, liking a show is subjective. I and many others (as a few have stated) loved Iditarod.

[Imagine]

As far as having the same bands/school districts at the top be boring--I don't feel that way at all. While I loved having Vista Ridge smash their way into the top this year and find that to be incredibly exciting, I also love it when a band who is "always the bridesmaid, never the bride" makes it to the top. There are a number of bands who are always finalists but who never actually win or even make top 3. But you know their name and you know their shows and you know they're probably going to be a lock for finals every year. So you might think that's boring. But every year I always hope to see one of them (the bridesmaids) finally reach their goal of coming out on top. I know what it feels like to get so close you can taste it, but never actually reach your goal. So to me that's exciting to watch those same groups who put out excellence every year, strive just that much harder to get just thatmuchcloser to the medal stand. It's just a different kind of exciting.

 

And I also have to add that back in the days when Marcus was at the top of the heap every single year, I never found their shows to be boring. I remember watching in awe and just sitting back and enjoying the show. I knew everyone else was fighting for second place. But that didn't make Marcus's shows any less incredible and exciting to watch. 

[GreedyGreen]

Hello there. I'm new to this forum and had to create an account so I could chime in.

 

Let's not get (1) "The ability to put together winner shows year by year is far from boring" confused with (2) performing a winning show created by someone else.

 

This year, no doubt, Vista Ridge was the hottest band on the circuit. They brought it - hands down. They were, BY FAR, the most improved band in the state - culminating with the 6A state win.

 

But lets remember where show themes come from. They are either (1) original - completely original or somewhat original or (2) a rehashed version of someone else's originality.

 

VR's show was very tightly copied from Hendrickson's 2015 "Lost" - from the spinning compass right down to Amazing Grace. Not to mention the version of "Lost" the Boston Crusader's did in 2018 - again, right down to Amazing Grace.

 

Great ideas never die away, they just get recycled - or in some cases sold to other bands to redo on their own.

 

VR marched their socks off - don't get me wrong, it was spectacular. I am not hating on VR. I loved their show each time I saw it.

 

But to put those bands in the same category as bands who create winning shows year after year is a stretch. Let's not forget VR's 2017 sled dog race show. Just an overall bad idea.

 

Having the creativity to come up with a great fresh show idea every year is a rare talent - most bands don't have that luxury.

 

If you want to see a recent example of bands buying/stealing/reusing someone's else's originality, take a look at Hendrickson's 2017 show "Just Another Brick". This show was highly original and creative.

 

Go to You Tube and search "2018 high school band just another brick" and see how many high schools took Hendrickson's originality and recycled it just 1 year later.

 

On the alter of originality, I must confess that someone told me about the "brick" story - so it wasn't originality on my part. I just thought it was a perfect story for my post.

 

Thanks for letting me chime in.

I get that this is just your opinion, but I am failing to see the point you are trying to make and I can say with certainty that what comes through (intended or not) is saltiness at a particular group. I suggest you go read the BOA/UIL handbooks for judges. (I did this while I was bored in one of my lectures oops)

There is nothing that says originality is part of the judging criteria nor should it be. The marching arts has become such a large category of fine arts and as such has its own economic norms. Shows are bought and sold WAYYY more than you probably think and music is recycled 24/7 by composers.

I want to make it clear that I don’t think vista ridge had anything but their kids hard work on the field. (Also I can tell this is probably a Hendrickson student; go listen to CTJ 2014 and I bet you will be pretty shocked lol) It just proves my point that the marching arts is more than just coming up with original ideas, because ultimately there is a limited selection of music to choose from and only so many colors you can put on the field.

I suggest you go listen to the top 9 from San Antonio from 2012 onward and I bet you will find a multitude of similarities.

[Guest]

I get that this is just your opinion, but I am failing to see the point you are trying to make and I can say with certainty that what comes through (intended or not) is saltiness at a particular group. I suggest you go read the BOA/UIL handbooks for judges. (I did this while I was bored in one of my lectures oops)

There is nothing that says originality is part of the judging criteria nor should it be. The marching arts has become such a large category of fine arts and as such has its own economic norms. Shows are bought and sold WAYYY more than you probably think and music is recycled 24/7 by composers.

I want to make it clear that I don’t think vista ridge had anything but their kids hard work on the field. (Also I can tell this is probably a Hendrickson student; go listen to CTJ 2014 and I bet you will be pretty shocked lol) It just proves my point that the marching arts is more than just coming up with original ideas, because ultimately there is a limited selection of music to choose from and only so many colors you can put on the field.

I suggest you go listen to the top 9 from San Antonio from 2012 onward and I bet you will find a multitude of similarities.

Indeed. Many great points made.

[GBMELLO]

Does anyone know if they still sell DVD's of the SMC?

[Mmalpica9]

Hello there. I'm new to this forum and had to create an account so I could chime in.

 

Let's not get (1) "The ability to put together winner shows year by year is far from boring" confused with (2) performing a winning show created by someone else.

 

This year, no doubt, Vista Ridge was the hottest band on the circuit. They brought it - hands down. They were, BY FAR, the most improved band in the state - culminating with the 6A state win.

 

But lets remember where show themes come from. They are either (1) original - completely original or somewhat original or (2) a rehashed version of someone else's originality.

 

VR's show was very tightly copied from Hendrickson's 2015 "Lost" - from the spinning compass right down to Amazing Grace. Not to mention the version of "Lost" the Boston Crusader's did in 2018 - again, right down to Amazing Grace.

 

Great ideas never die away, they just get recycled - or in some cases sold to other bands to redo on their own.

 

VR marched their socks off - don't get me wrong, it was spectacular. I am not hating on VR. I loved their show each time I saw it.

 

But to put those bands in the same category as bands who create winning shows year after year is a stretch. Let's not forget VR's 2017 sled dog race show. Just an overall bad idea.

 

Having the creativity to come up with a great fresh show idea every year is a rare talent - most bands don't have that luxury.

 

If you want to see a recent example of bands buying/stealing/reusing someone's else's originality, take a look at Hendrickson's 2017 show "Just Another Brick". This show was highly original and creative.

 

Go to You Tube and search "2018 high school band just another brick" and see how many high schools took Hendrickson's originality and recycled it just 1 year later.

 

On the alter of originality, I must confess that someone told me about the "brick" story - so it wasn't originality on my part. I just thought it was a perfect story for my post.

 

Thanks for letting me chime in.

Hi:

 

I'm as well struggling to understand what your point is. I just watched Hendrickson 2015 "Lost" show and I think you are using the phrase "tightly copied" a little bit too liberally. Indeed they share the word "Lost", the compass and that's pretty much it (I couldn't find "Amazing Grace" on it but probably I need to re-check it). The drills, the pace, the emotions are very different and unique on each show. A good exercise could be to watch the shows back to back.

 

About original ideas... stories are always talking the same ideas. This is the very concept of archetypes from Carl G. Jung. If you review the many shows you'll always will find similar stories: exploration, discovery, heroism, space, opposites,  dreams, fears, struggle, conviction, circus, great classics, arabian, spanish, russian, etc. Just this year 2 shows talked about "Blueprints". Amazing Grace probably is one of the most used pieces of music on marching shows but the same can be said about other pieces like "Rhapsody in Blue" (most schools with a very good soloist will try this as Hendrickson did this year, this guy was amazing). Those are pieces that are natural generators of emotions. The important thing on marching band, in my opinion, is execution not originality. The very same piece can generate very different emotions if they are interpreted by different performers. The way one piece of music follows the next one also generate unique reactions. For instance, the great finale of Vista's show is not Amazing Grace but the return to the "Lost" theme in a triumphant way as a finish of a build up that started probably at the beginning of the ballad in the second movement. The way both bands told the story about being lost and back is very different.

 

I wouldn't categorize bands for it's ability to create "original" shows (as I mentioned this claim is very hard to prove... however I believe "Iditarod" was a very fresh idea probably not too much explored in the past. I think your point in favor of originality clash with your opinion on Iditarod. It may have flaws in execution but I believe it was a pretty original idea) but I'd categorize them by their ability to generate new reactions using known elements. I saw the mountains of Iditarod show being re-used for one show on BoA San Antonio. This doesn't demerit the actual show given by the band. If a band has to buy a known show due to lack of resources, that does not demerit them. I'd judge them by their ability to take that and provide an amazing performance that will put emotions to the crowd. That will take them apart as Vista Ridge did on 2018.

[Rudedog34]

LOL

Both "Blueprints" shows were from schools in the same district a few miles from each other. Go figure.

[LeanderMomma]

Just watched Vista Ridge and their finals 6A state run and got goosebumps all over again. Geez that thing was spectacular!

[Samuel Culper]

Just watched Vista Ridge and their finals 6A state run and got goosebumps all over again. Geez that thing was spectacular!

I refuse to admit to how many times I have rewatched it. But it's pretty close to the number of times I have watched Leander and CTJ mob the Vista kids at "break ranks".

[gregorydf01]

I refuse to admit to how many times I have rewatched it. But it's pretty close to the number of times I have watched Leander and CTJ mob the Vista kids at "break ranks".

I have to watch the Retreat video every now and then just to confirm I wasn't dreaming and it really happened and then enjoy the mob scene.  I also can't admit how many times I have watched the show video, a bit obsessive probably...