2021 Texas Marching Classic (Oct. 9)

[Tubalord11]

17 minutes ago, Hard Core Band Fan said:

Just have to mention the absence of Round Rock at this competition. This is right in their backyard and they choose to go to Westlake instead. If anyone needs more competition and to be pushed and made better, it's them. Can't understand the logic behind this. Huge opportunity missed again.

Facts! This contest would be way more valuable for them then Westlake by a mile.

[principalagent]

40 minutes ago, Tubalord11 said:

Facts! This contest would be way more valuable for them then Westlake by a mile.

They’ve historically had a great relationship with the Westlake program, and this marching contest, for decades now and perhaps they prefer this loyalty. I do agree that it isn’t as competitive, but for a long season, that can be okay. 

[Hard Core Band Fan]

16 minutes ago, principalagent said:

They’ve historically had a great relationship with the Westlake program, and this marching contest, for decades now and perhaps they prefer this loyalty. I do agree that it isn’t as competitive, but for a long season, that can be okay. 

Well, they are not going to any other competition until BOA San Antonio. UIL is the only other event for them. Being a big fish in a very small pond at Westlake is not a program-building strategy.

[Time Warp]

11 minutes ago, Hard Core Band Fan said:

Well, they are not going to any other competition until BOA San Antonio. UIL is the only other event for them. Being a big fish in a very small pond at Westlake is not a program-building strategy.

Who pissed in your cereal?

[Hard Core Band Fan]

18 minutes ago, Time Warp said:

Who pissed in your cereal?

No one, and yours? This is a valid assessment. I think these kids are being shortchanged. With a program that is struggling year after year to barely make it in most finals, the leadership seems to take the same path. It's been the same way since my kids went through the program there. 

[CTJBandPops]

10 minutes ago, Time Warp said:

Who pissed in your cereal?

not sure why everyone gets so bent when someone makes a comment about strategy, I took a similar beating earlier this year when I made a comment about a program spending a great deal of money to go to Grand Nats but not attending any other BOA Events that year or even in the past few years.

Every program uses a different approach and that is there right. but you would think that you would want to get another opportunity to compete in your back yard against some of the same programs you will see again at BOA-SA as well as in Indy and get comments from the adjudicators on the performance opinions so you can make adjustments before SA and G Nats.

It has been mentioned that CTJ will be attending this year, this will be there first time here since 2012. Why? Because, while TMC is not a BOA Event it is mostly scored like one. 2 of the Music judges from BOA Austin will also be at TMC and it is a chance to see what they think of your progress over the past 2 weeks . and many of the same judges that are at TMC will also be at BOA-SA and more importantly at Grand Nats. so you want those comments now so you can adjust to their comments in hopes of elevating those scores at the later events scored by the same judges.

I tried to make that same point with the beating I took earlier this year. if you are going all in to spend $400K to make a trip to Indy, you would think you would want to get your band in front of those judges as often as possible to get those opinions - especially if they will be judging you again later in the season. just my thoughts.

 

[Dog885]

Breaking news: Dripping Springs has dropped in favor of going to Westlake

[Dog885]

1 hour ago, principalagent said:

They’ve historically had a great relationship with the Westlake program, and this marching contest, for decades now and perhaps they prefer this loyalty. I do agree that it isn’t as competitive, but for a long season, that can be okay. 

I also want to add, going to a competition like Westlake and winning is a good morale booster for the kids.

[Samuel Culper]

Not all of these decisions are made with strategy in mind.  Yes, Round Rock goes to the Westlake contest out of loyalty.  Frankly, I admire them for that.  The Westlake folks are awesome and run a great contest.

[LostChoirGuy]

I think it is important to realize that those of us in this community are biased towards seeing highly competitive contests and seeing bands compete at a high level, but this is not the only thing that band programs are concerned about.  Smaller local contests are important fundraisers for many bands and are also opportunities to make connections and help smaller programs to improve.  As said before, competing at these contests can also provide a boost of confidence.

Another example: There are a number of small contests that occur each year on the dame day as BOA DFW in the DFW metroplex and some programs that are quite involved in BOA choose to attend these instead.  Some may say this is a mistake because the BOA contest is the biggest and most competitive, but there is a lot to be said about the loyalty of attending these contests.  It is also somewhat interesting to see what happens when these groups from different contests come together for UIL or BOA San Antonio.  Groups like Wylie get overlooked nearly every year because they don't typically compete against many top bands until San Antonio.

[Hard Core Band Fan]

18 minutes ago, Dog885 said:

I also want to add, going to a competition like Westlake and winning is a good morale booster for the kids.

Morale boosters are fine, but are not going to prepare you for a real competition. Getting a 95 at Westlake isn't going to prepare you for San Antonio or the Grand Nationals. To feel good for a day or two and then getting stomped a couple of weeks later isn't really all that helpful. I want the best for these kids. Iron sharpens iron. Taking the lesser path has had a long term effect on this program and I don't like seeing it repeated. They work hard and should reap more than minimal benefits from it.

Edited October 5, 2021 by Hard Core Band Fan
Horrible typist.

[Hard Core Band Fan]

14 minutes ago, Samuel Culper said:

Not all of these decisions are made with strategy in mind.  Yes, Round Rock goes to the Westlake contest out of loyalty.  Frankly, I admire them for that.  The Westlake folks are awesome and run a great contest.

So why aren't the better bands attending this competition if it's such a valid option? Why have all of the top tier programs moved on to better options? Just because you have a history of doing something doesn't mean you should continue to do it. Loyalty isn't always a reason for doing something.

 

[Dog885]

8 minutes ago, Hard Core Band Fan said:

Morale boosters are fine, but are not going to prepare you for a real competition. Getting a 95 at Westlake isn't going to prepare you for San Antonio or the Grand Nationals. To feel good for a day or two and then getting stomped a couple of weeks later isn't really all that helpful. I want the best for these kids. Iron sharpens iron. Taking the lesser path has had a long term effect on this program and I don't like seeing it repeated. They work hard and should reap more than minimal benefits from it.

You're forgetting the most important parts. These are kids. Judges' feedback does not matter to a majority of them, what matters to them is if they're getting a good experience. This is still a good competition, they are still going to get good feedback. You act as if there are only 5 good judges in the world and they're all at TMC. There are plenty of people qualified to judge. If the kids have a good time at Westlake, then why care where they go? Not everyone has to be super competitive, you have to still provide an enjoyable experience for the kids. What's best for the kids isn't going to the toughest competitions, it's giving them good memories that'll last for decades. Most of them won't study music, so being in band won't have a large impact on their jobs, people join to do things they enjoy.

[itsjaredh97]

38 minutes ago, Dog885 said:

There are plenty of people qualified to judge. If the kids have a good time at Westlake, then why care where they go? Not everyone has to be super competitive, you have to still provide an enjoyable experience for the kids. What's best for the kids isn't going to the toughest competitions, it's giving them good memories that'll last for decades. 

Sadly, I feel like a lot of people look over this. I know for me this was the case when we went to VRMF last week. We knew it wasn't going to be nearly as competitive as the other competitions we are attending, but we still had an incredibly enjoyable experience, especially after winning it. For a lot of kids, especially underclassmen, it was their first amazing memory of marching band that they got to enjoy and will look back on, and for me that's super important to me, especially as a senior.

[Dog885]

12 minutes ago, itsjaredh97 said:

Sadly, I feel like a lot of people look over this. I know for me this was the case when we went to VRMF last week. We knew it wasn't going to be nearly as competitive as the other competitions we are attending, but we still had an incredibly enjoyable experience, especially after winning it. For a lot of kids, especially underclassmen, it was their first amazing memory of marching band that they got to enjoy and will look back on, and for me that's super important to me, especially as a senior.

Yeah, one good memory that stands out for a lot of people I went to high school with was nearly clean sweeping the USBands event out in Liberty Hill. It's all about the experience

[CTJBandPops]

54 minutes ago, Dog885 said:

 What's best for the kids isn't going to the toughest competitions, it's giving them good memories that'll last for decades. Most of them won't study music, so being in band won't have a large impact on their jobs, people join to do things they enjoy.

I can tell you that your statement in bold above is incorrect, and I say that from experience. I marched in High School band 35 years ago, and never went on to study music, my kids won't either. but my band experience has shaped my adult life in many ways and I credit it for my success as an adult. That is why I wanted my kids to be in band , and sometimes the life experience comes from going up against the best and giving it everything you have and not quite getting the prize.

this is from a Wakeland Band parent that was posted in 2014. This is what band gives our kids.

One of my friends asked "Why do you pay so much money for your kids to be in band?" Well I have a confession to make, I don't pay for my kids' band experience. Personally, it doesn't matter which activity they choose.

So, if I am not paying for band, what am I paying for?

- I pay for those moments when my kids become so tired they want to quit - but don't.

- I pay for those days when my kids come home from school and are "too tired" to go to rehearsal - but go anyway.

- I pay for my kids to learn to be disciplined.

- I pay for my kids to learn to take care of their body.

- I pay for my kids to learn to work with others and be good team mates.

- I pay for my kids to learn to deal with disappointment, when they don't get that score they'd hoped for, - but still have to work hard every day.

- I pay for my kids to learn to make and accomplish goals.

- I pay for my kids to learn that it takes hours and hours and hours and hours of hard work and practice to create a champion, and that success does not happen overnight.

- I pay for the opportunity my kids have and will have to make life-long friendships.

- I pay so that my kids can be in a rehearsal instead of in front of a screen.

- I pay for my kids to learn how to be part of something, much bigger than themselves

I could go on, but, in short, I don't pay for band. I pay for the opportunities that band provides my kids with to develop attributes that will serve them well throughout their lives and give them the opportunity to bless the lives of others.

From what I have seen so far, I think it is a great investment!

 

[Dog885]

1 hour ago, banddad84 said:

I can tell you that your statement in bold above is incorrect, and I say that from experience. I marched in High School band 35 years ago, and never went on to study music, my kids won't either. but my band experience has shaped my adult life in many ways and I credit it for my success as an adult. That is why I wanted my kids to be in band , and sometimes the life experience comes from going up against the best and giving it everything you have and not quite getting the prize.

this is from a Wakeland Band parent that was posted in 2014. This is what band gives our kids.

One of my friends asked "Why do you pay so much money for your kids to be in band?" Well I have a confession to make, I don't pay for my kids' band experience. Personally, it doesn't matter which activity they choose.

So, if I am not paying for band, what am I paying for?

- I pay for those moments when my kids become so tired they want to quit - but don't.

- I pay for those days when my kids come home from school and are "too tired" to go to rehearsal - but go anyway.

- I pay for my kids to learn to be disciplined.

- I pay for my kids to learn to take care of their body.

- I pay for my kids to learn to work with others and be good team mates.

- I pay for my kids to learn to deal with disappointment, when they don't get that score they'd hoped for, - but still have to work hard every day.

- I pay for my kids to learn to make and accomplish goals.

- I pay for my kids to learn that it takes hours and hours and hours and hours of hard work and practice to create a champion, and that success does not happen overnight.

- I pay for the opportunity my kids have and will have to make life-long friendships.

- I pay so that my kids can be in a rehearsal instead of in front of a screen.

- I pay for my kids to learn how to be part of something, much bigger than themselves

I could go on, but, in short, I don't pay for band. I pay for the opportunities that band provides my kids with to develop attributes that will serve them well throughout their lives and give them the opportunity to bless the lives of others.

From what I have seen so far, I think it is a great investment!

 

I admit, I worded that incorrectly. I meant it won't be as big of a factor in jobs like your major of degree. I completely agree it teaches life skills and gives great experiences that won't be directly obvious to a job. Jobs don't care about if you marched with a band that won a BOA Super Regional, they care more about the things you learned and what it contributed to making you a better person

Edited October 5, 2021 by Dog885
Edited because I realized a better way to say this

[bingogooberman]

Round Rock choosing to attend Westlake has never prevented them from reaching grand national finals in the past and it won't this year either ?

[Hard Core Band Fan]

1 minute ago, bingogooberman said:

Round Rock choosing to attend Westlake has never prevented them from reaching grand national finals in the past and it won't this year either ?

Bold statement. And you're right, if that doesn't happen for them this year, it won't just be because they chose an easier path competitively. Maybe it's the attitude of "we always make it" that spells doom for them. Nothing is guaranteed, especially when the groups around you are getting better and better each year. Optimism can be misused.

 

[LHSax]

31 minutes ago, Hard Core Band Fan said:

Bold statement. And you're right, if that doesn't happen for them this year, it won't just be because they chose an easier path competitively. Maybe it's the attitude of "we always make it" that spells doom for them. Nothing is guaranteed, especially when the groups around you are getting better and better each year. Optimism can be misused.

 

I guarantee the "they always find a way to make it" crowd is exclusive to those of us band fan onlookers who have watched it happen time and time again over the last decade, and has nothing to do with the mentality of the band and staff itself...

[Samuel Culper]

50 minutes ago, Hard Core Band Fan said:

Bold statement. And you're right, if that doesn't happen for them this year, it won't just be because they chose an easier path competitively. Maybe it's the attitude of "we always make it" that spells doom for them. Nothing is guaranteed, especially when the groups around you are getting better and better each year. Optimism can be misused.

I really think you have made your point, repeatedly, and need to dial it back now.

Also, there is nothing in the statement "Round Rock choosing to attend Westlake has never prevented them from reaching grand national finals in the past and it won't this year either" that is some guarantee that they will make Finals at GNats this year. If it happens or it doesn't happen, it won't have ANYTHING to do with the decision to go to Westlake over TMC.

[Samuel Culper]

1 hour ago, itsjaredh97 said:

Sadly, I feel like a lot of people look over this. I know for me this was the case when we went to VRMF last week. We knew it wasn't going to be nearly as competitive as the other competitions we are attending, but we still had an incredibly enjoyable experience, especially after winning it. For a lot of kids, especially underclassmen, it was their first amazing memory of marching band that they got to enjoy and will look back on, and for me that's super important to me, especially as a senior.

As the guy in charge of running the VRMF, I appreciate reading this.  Congrats on a wonderful pair of performances!

Also, we brought together an EXCELLENT panel of judges from across the country, so I know that all of our bands got some great feedback this weekend.

[LeanderMomma]

Prelims schedule (updated):

9:45 AM Bowie HS

10:00 AM Jack C Hays HS

10:15 AM Winston Churchill HS

BREAK 

11:00 AM Rouse HS

11:15 AM McCallum HS

11:30 AM Pflugerville HS

11:45 AM Samuel V Champion HS

12:00 PM Georgetown HS

12:15 PM Vandegrift HS

LUNCH 

1:30 PM Stony Point HS

1:45 PM McNeil HS

2:00 PM Cedar Park HS

2:15 PM Leander HS

2:30 PM Belton HS

2:45 PM Claudia Taylor Johnson HS

BREAK 

3:15 PM Robert E Hendrickson HS

3:30 PM Louise D. Brandeis HS

3:45 PM Weiss HS

4:00 PM John B Alexander HS

4:15 PM Ronald Reagan HS

Edited October 5, 2021 by LeanderMomma
Dripping Springs dropped out 10/5

[abtwitch]

I think the guy just doesn’t like Round Rock cause he never got on to criticize CTJ for going to contests like BOA McAllen and Midland, Judson Rocket Review, or Rough Rider. Or look at Burleson Centennial dropping BOA Austin to instead attend a local USBands competition which they won by nearly 4 points. Or Hebron and Flower Mound going to local contests where they absolutely dominated. I could go on and on, but you get the idea. Programs should be able to choose what contests they want to go to for any reason they like, whether it’s for “competitive strategy,” experience for the kids, loyalty to another program, or whatever. What matters at the end of the day is that the kids are getting out there and performing their show in spite of everything that’s going on around them. 

[Dog885]

1 minute ago, LeanderMomma said:

 

Prelims schedule:

9:30 AM Bowie HS

9:45 AM Dripping Springs HS

10:00 AM Jack C Hays HS

10:15 AM Winston Churchill HS

BREAK 

11:00 AM Rouse HS

11:15 AM McCallum HS

11:30 AM Pflugerville HS

11:45 AM Samuel V Champion HS

12:00 PM Georgetown HS

12:15 PM Vandegrift HS

LUNCH 

1:30 PM Stony Point HS

1:45 PM McNeil HS

2:00 PM Cedar Park HS

2:15 PM Leander HS

2:30 PM Belton HS

2:45 PM Claudia Taylor Johnson HS

BREAK 

3:15 PM Robert E Hendrickson HS

3:30 PM Louise D. Brandeis HS

3:45 PM Weiss HS

4:00 PM John B Alexander HS

4:15 PM Ronald Reagan HS

Thank you for getting us back on topic. I wonder when or if Dripping Springs will be taken off the TMC schedule because of their new listing for Westlake