josephbandfan Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 Here are the rankings with the bands that had a competitive season in 2020 bolded Hebron VandegriftMarcusFlower Mound Coppell Ronald Reagan Cedar RidgeCTJ Keller Westlake Vista Ridge Carroll Bandmomlover and CTJBandPops 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bxOxAxUIL Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 Does Ronald Reagan play Running Up That Hill in the beginning of their show? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BandFan59 Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 26 minutes ago, Ants_VS_Cotton Balls said: First and foremost congratulations to Hebron, very VERY well deserved, and what I'm about to say is not to take away from their victory or any bands placement tonight. However, I need someone to help me understand the inconsistencies between judging panels at UIL. BOA is far from perfect, but they at least seem to be more consistent over their competitions. There is no doubt that bands have good runs and bad runs and that a lot of progress can be made within even just a week, but it seems a large portion of UIL is just a crapshoot with what judges you get. Again, I know that BOA, and all judged events for that matter, have a similar fatal flaw, but UIL just seems to suffer from it worse than most. Look at vista ridge over vandy or ctj over reagan from the Area competitions or look at BOASA from this past weekend (an event that UIL is trying to judge more like) yet you have CTJ dropping to 8th while just the other day taking bronze at BOASA. (again they are 2 separate competitions and judged differently, but you can't convince me Jarrett Lipman didn't piss in the judges cheerios over the weekend) Jokes aside, I really am curious as to why UIL suffers so much more from discrepancies compared to other judged events, so please, enlighten me fellow band nerds UIL's ordinal judging probably contributes to that. It's not a great system and I really wish they would just switch to raw scores like BOA does, but I don't think it'll happen any time soon. Franus and VandyBandyFandy 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Asaiah Posted November 10, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted November 10, 2021 Can every future Hebron show end in an "H-pull" drill move? Cause I wouldn't mind! JoGn Doe, bxOxAxUIL, Alaric and 6 others 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BandMom75 Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 13 minutes ago, bxOxAxUIL said: Does Ronald Reagan play Running Up That Hill in the beginning of their show? Yes they do Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DallasFan Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 13 minutes ago, BandFan59 said: UIL's ordinal judging probably contributes to that. It's not a great system and I really wish they would just switch to raw scores like BOA does, but I don't think it'll happen any time soon. I asked this same question for 5A state finals in the thread. I forget the user but he went through and made it clear, raw scores vs ordinals was not different much, if at all. Would love to do that for this contest but idk where to find the raw scores Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beffjezos Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 does anyone know if hebron did a encore run for any competition? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackson1 Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 Do not believe they have ever done an encore. Didn't at SA. 5 te 6, Bladezz and beffjezos 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BandDad4 Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 33 minutes ago, BandFan59 said: UIL's ordinal judging probably contributes to that. It's not a great system and I really wish they would just switch to raw scores like BOA does, but I don't think it'll happen any time soon. oh for the love of God no .. BOA is the absolute worst. Please do not tarnish UIL with BOA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackson1 Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 As crazy as this is, Hebron has only won a couple of regional competitions. They have never won a "Major" prior to this week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackson1 Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 A LOT of seconds and thirds though...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trumpette123 Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 20 minutes ago, BandDad4 said: oh for the love of God no .. BOA is the absolute worst. Please do not tarnish UIL with BOA Mmm I’d disagree. UIL disregards a decent bit of some of these shows. There is a reason why Marcus beat 4 bands they lost to 3 days ago. I think neither system is perfect. VandyBandyFandy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post BandDad4 Posted November 10, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted November 10, 2021 4 minutes ago, Trumpette123 said: Mmm I’d disagree. UIL disregards a decent bit of some of these shows. There is a reason why Marcus beat 4 bands they lost to 3 days ago. I think neither system is perfect. Disregards what in particular? If we are talking about the props and the pageantry. I'd say that is a good thing. Franus, KinDallas and Karma_Savior 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marchingbandperson Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 6 minutes ago, BandDad4 said: Disregards what in particular? If we are talking about the props and the pageantry. I'd say that is a good thing. Reagan broke the record at boa San Antonio without any props, I don’t think at any event props play a major factor in scoring as you know, marching fundamentals and music are sorta important ViewFromTheBox 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trumpette123 Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 10 minutes ago, BandDad4 said: Disregards what in particular? If we are talking about the props and the pageantry. I'd say that is a good thing. This isn’t some 70s, 80s, 90s drums and bugle corps we are watching these days. It’s the marching arts. The pageantry absolutely shouldn’t be disregarded. Props… idk. Not every district can afford a drum corps turning platform. But that’s why I said they BOTH have flaws. BOA judges to much effect and I think UIL doesn’t judge enough. The effect disregarded out of CTJ and flower mound is unfortunate. Getting a high school boy that isn’t in theatre to portray a happy theme isn’t easy. The kids are clearly bought in. ViewFromTheBox and CTJBandPops 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stellamo Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 1 hour ago, bxOxAxUIL said: Does Ronald Reagan play Running Up That Hill in the beginning of their show? Yes, they quote it throughout the show Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post vistaridgefan42069 Posted November 10, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted November 10, 2021 oh, people who think effect is derived from props and pageantry… tools don’t build a house unless you use em right BandMom75, BandFan59, itsstephenyo and 7 others 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post CTJBandPops Posted November 10, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted November 10, 2021 1 hour ago, BandDad4 said: oh for the love of God no .. BOA is the absolute worst. Please do not tarnish UIL with BOA Every program has the ability to opt out of BOA - with UIL, not so much. the UIL scoring process is a known antiquated hot mess. this year was going to be different with a 7 judge panel that would reward both guard and percussion. it was trialed in 5A State in 2019 with shadow judges to see how it went and was not done in 2020 due to the pandemic. It was again a hot mess that had no consistency with very wide swings from prelims and finals and no understanding to how the judging was done. BOA is far from perfect, but you know what to expect. BandMom75, VandyBandyFandy, LeanderMomma and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DallasFan Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 4 minutes ago, banddad84 said: Every program has the ability to opt out of BOA - with UIL, not so much. the UIL scoring process is a known antiquated hot mess. this year was going to be different with a 7 judge panel that would reward both guard and percussion. it was trialed in 5A State in 2019 with shadow judges to see how it went and was not done in 2020 due to the pandemic. It was again a hot mess that had no consistency with very wide swings from prelims and finals and no understanding to how the judging was done. BOA is far from perfect, but you know what to expect. I do think the new system is much better then what it was before. I tend to believe the inconsistencies came from the fact most of the panel changes between prelims and finals rather then a “flawed” system. Different judges have different ideas for what they like to listen for or see. I don’t know if there is/was training for these contests but this is the first use of this system. I expected some interesting results. But it cannot be horribly flawed considering they, in most peoples eyes and ears, got the top 2 correct in prelims and finals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bk_bobb Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 It seems as if the UIL ‘Content/Design’ ranking is how the bands would’ve placed using BOA metrics… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post BPTMN Posted November 10, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted November 10, 2021 Hebron band parent here. Thank you for all the kind words and support these past days. It’s truly an honor to be chosen the winner among an amazing field of exceptional bands in our state. We are celebrating but are excited to cheer for our fellow LISD and other TX bands going to Grand Nats! Show them what band in Texas is all about! sttng, LeanderMomma, InIt4Fun and 6 others 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nny14 Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 1 hour ago, Jackson1 said: Do not believe they have ever done an encore. Didn't at SA. Well since they're going to the Rose Parade I believe they'll get to perform the show again at the Pasadena Bandfest LeanderMomma and jmj 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PLC137 Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 To understand why both UIL and BOA scoring - indeed any subjective scoring systems - are imperfect (maybe to different degrees), you have to consider variability and unconscious bias. Read the book "Noise," by Nobel Laureate Daniel Kahneman, for example. One you accept this, it makes the competitions more enjoyable because your expectations are more calibrated. principalagent and VinoGirl 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BPTMN Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 29 minutes ago, Nny14 said: Well since they're going to the Rose Parade I believe they'll get to perform the show again at the Pasadena Bandfest We do. FloMoParent 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slowbrass Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 WOOHOOOOOOOOO also, does anyone have the detailed finals recaps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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