UIL 5A State Marching Contest 2023

[Tailgate88]

13 hours ago, Tubalord11 said:

Finally back home. Congratulations to Cedar Park on now the 5-peat! It's crazy how much they turn on the switch when it comes to state, was still a completely different band from the one we saw less than a week before. I do feel for those kids at Rouse, beating them by significant amounts all year just to lose by a small amount, but with state being each year for a good while, I feel like someone's bound to dethrone CP, right?? Huge congrats to Forney and @clarinetistkai05 on the 4th place!!! While hearing Leander get 5th was a bit shocking, Forney's finals performance was just SO GOOD. Bottom half was about right, although I didn't see F-wood getting 11th, and the Henny jump was a surprise but not unexpected. Really happy to see Lone Star not drop like they did in 2019 ( don't know what that was about), but yeah, other than that pretty much lined out to what I thought it would be. Finally, to all the band kids, thank you for all the hard work you did this season to allow us to be entertained, emotionally damaged, and absolutely blown away by your amazing shows! It's really crazy to think that were pretty much done with marching band here in Texas. It's the last year that I will know anyone personally in my High school's band, which kinda feels weird, but I'll be rooting for them regardless. This year was definitely one if not the most competitive all around years in Texas, and I know next season is going to be even better! But again, to all the members of all the bands, thank you for all you do for us band lovers, enthusiast, and nerds around the world! 

Next year, all the kids affected by the Covid mess should be graduated. I expect even greater performances! 

[BandDad4Life]

While driving back from San Antonio last night I started thinking about numbers. How many bands with 200+ kids vs those with less than 200. I found the results interesting. 

Number of 5A schools in Texas - 251.

The smallest band to compete - Liberty Hill HS with 120. 

The largest bands to compete - Aledo HS and Lebanon Trail HS with 238 each. 

The 5A State Champion Cedar Park HS with 237. 

Out of 35 schools to compete in prelims, 12 had 200+ while 23 had less than 200. 

The 12 schools to compete in finals, 8 had 200+ while 4 had less than 200. 

The top 5 schools had 200+. Burleson Centennial HS finished 6th as the highest ranked school with less than 200. Richland HS was the second one at 9th.

this means 8 of the top 10 had 200+ students in the band.

What does this all mean?  Nothing most likely but it definitely appears that having a larger band helps. No matter what size, it’s all about who performs their show the best. This year, it was Cedar Parks HS. 

Congratulations to Cedar Park and everyone else who got to perform at the SMBC!

[ChristopherRoden]

1 hour ago, BandDad4Life said:

While driving back from San Antonio last night I started thinking about numbers. How many bands with 200+ kids vs those with less than 200. I found the results interesting. 

Number of 5A schools in Texas - 251.

The smallest band to compete - Liberty Hill HS with 120. 

The largest bands to compete - Aledo HS and Lebanon Trail HS with 238 each. 

The 5A State Champion Cedar Park HS with 237. 

Out of 35 schools to compete in prelims, 12 had 200+ while 23 had less than 200. 

The 12 schools to compete in finals, 8 had 200+ while 4 had less than 200. 

The top 5 schools had 200+. Burleson Centennial HS finished 6th as the highest ranked school with less than 200. Richland HS was the second one at 9th.

this means 8 of the top 10 had 200+ students in the band.

What does this all mean?  Nothing most likely but it definitely appears that having a larger band helps. No matter what size, it’s all about who performs their show the best. This year, it was Cedar Parks HS. 

Congratulations to Cedar Park and everyone else who got to perform at the SMBC!

Curious how the numbers look for 6A too! 

[MikeKyu]

3 hours ago, tennertrumbow said:

actually i can do more than just the results. i have pictures of the full sheet breakdowns from that year.

2019 SMBC Prelims

 

2019 SMBC Finals

 

excuse the highlighting thats from my director

Needed to request access to the doc. 

[tennertrumbow]

3 hours ago, MikeKyu said:

Needed to request access to the doc. 

oops sorry that’s fixed now

[RRBND27]

5 hours ago, BandDad4Life said:

While driving back from San Antonio last night I started thinking about numbers. How many bands with 200+ kids vs those with less than 200. I found the results interesting. 

Number of 5A schools in Texas - 251.

The smallest band to compete - Liberty Hill HS with 120. 

The largest bands to compete - Aledo HS and Lebanon Trail HS with 238 each. 

The 5A State Champion Cedar Park HS with 237. 

Out of 35 schools to compete in prelims, 12 had 200+ while 23 had less than 200. 

The 12 schools to compete in finals, 8 had 200+ while 4 had less than 200. 

The top 5 schools had 200+. Burleson Centennial HS finished 6th as the highest ranked school with less than 200. Richland HS was the second one at 9th.

this means 8 of the top 10 had 200+ students in the band.

What does this all mean?  Nothing most likely but it definitely appears that having a larger band helps. No matter what size, it’s all about who performs their show the best. This year, it was Cedar Parks HS. 

Congratulations to Cedar Park and everyone else who got to perform at the SMBC!

I pondered these exact sentiments during the Finals no joke!!! Bigger band, bigger and stronger sound, makes for a better show imo! No matter how good a smaller band it won't ever be enough to ever outperform a large band that is solid. Thanks for doing the homework on this, I was interested to see the #'s and was surprised they were here lol. It's a crazy stat at the end of the day.

Cheers. 

[BandDad4Life]

4 hours ago, ChristopherRoden said:

Curious how the numbers look for 6A too! 

I don’t see the 6A program on the UIL app that had the numbers. It would be interesting to compare. 

[BandDad4Life]

6 minutes ago, RRBND27 said:

I pondered these exact sentiments during the Finals no joke!!! Bigger band, bigger and stronger sound, makes for a better show imo! No matter how good a smaller band it won't ever be enough to ever outperform a large band that is solid. Thanks for doing the homework on this, I was interested to see the #'s and was surprised they were here lol. It's a crazy stat at the end of the day.

Cheers. 

Another factor is money. Most of these schools have huge budgets and are able to buy everything. The smaller schools have a way smaller budget and piecing things together to have a show. Half a million dollar budgets and higher just blows my mind. 

[some guy]

On 11/7/2023 at 2:26 PM, Tubalord11 said:

Incredible performance from Lebanon Trail to open up finals! Love the "River Flows Through You" pre-show!!! Plenty of showcasing of the different ensembles throughout the band as well as full ensemble moments! Guard was a treat to watch, and I love the different snowflakes we get to see throughout the show. Really enjoyed that performance, great final's performance Lebanon Trail!!! 

A bit late but fun fact - our synth soloist is a freshman, and he started percussion in 8th grade

[Tubalord11]

4 minutes ago, some guy said:

A bit late but fun fact - our synth soloist is a freshman, and he started percussion in 8th grade

He’s so freaking good. I’m a pianist myself and played the piece in 6th grade and lm tell you, it ain’t easy. But it’s so beautiful and delicate and he played it perfectly!! I remember freaking out with my mom when we got to see y’all at Wylie bc she’s the one who wanted me to learn the song in the first place, he played it so well every time! 

[Samuel Culper]

20 hours ago, BandDad4Life said:

While driving back from San Antonio last night I started thinking about numbers. How many bands with 200+ kids vs those with less than 200. I found the results interesting. 

Number of 5A schools in Texas - 251.

The smallest band to compete - Liberty Hill HS with 120. 

The largest bands to compete - Aledo HS and Lebanon Trail HS with 238 each. 

The 5A State Champion Cedar Park HS with 237. 

Out of 35 schools to compete in prelims, 12 had 200+ while 23 had less than 200. 

The 12 schools to compete in finals, 8 had 200+ while 4 had less than 200. 

The top 5 schools had 200+. Burleson Centennial HS finished 6th as the highest ranked school with less than 200. Richland HS was the second one at 9th.

this means 8 of the top 10 had 200+ students in the band.

What does this all mean?  Nothing most likely but it definitely appears that having a larger band helps. No matter what size, it’s all about who performs their show the best. This year, it was Cedar Parks HS. 

Congratulations to Cedar Park and everyone else who got to perform at the SMBC!

The numbers thing is also very much a chicken and egg sort of deal. It's tempting to just look at the numbers and conclude that having a bigger band helps you place better, but I think it goes deeper than that. A school/district that puts a strong emphasis on music, and backs that up with resources and quality instructors, will naturally draw more kids from the school's enrollment.

So, in effect, some of those bands are bigger BECAUSE they are good.

[LostChoirGuy]

1 hour ago, Samuel Culper said:

The numbers thing is also very much a chicken and egg sort of deal. It's tempting to just look at the numbers and conclude that having a bigger band helps you place better, but I think it goes deeper than that. A school/district that puts a strong emphasis on music, and backs that up with resources and quality instructors, will naturally draw more kids from the school's enrollment.

So, in effect, some of those bands are bigger BECAUSE they are good.

I agree.  With so many activities and sports for kids to choose between, many will choose to join a program with a better chance of success.  If a high school band is known for consistently making state, students will want to join and be a part of that success.  Likewise, it is hard to have fun when you belong to a group that never performs well and doesn't have the resources put into the program to create compelling show designs and musical education.  When students don't have fun, they leave the program.

[RoyKentsGhost]

23 hours ago, BandDad4Life said:

While driving back from San Antonio last night I started thinking about numbers. How many bands with 200+ kids vs those with less than 200. I found the results interesting. 

Number of 5A schools in Texas - 251.

The smallest band to compete - Liberty Hill HS with 120. 

 

And only growing!

[BandDad4Life]

2 hours ago, Samuel Culper said:

The numbers thing is also very much a chicken and egg sort of deal. It's tempting to just look at the numbers and conclude that having a bigger band helps you place better, but I think it goes deeper than that. A school/district that puts a strong emphasis on music, and backs that up with resources and quality instructors, will naturally draw more kids from the school's enrollment.

So, in effect, some of those bands are bigger BECAUSE they are good.

Agree and not saying a school doesn’t make it just because they have a larger band. The percentages is greater but all of these bands got there because they’re good. There are many more schools who could have been at state. I’m still shocked Aledo wasn’t in finals. 
 

The school districts supporting fine arts is definitely key. But as I said before, it doesn’t matter how big or small a school is, it’s all about execution and precision. 

[BandDad4Life]

16 hours ago, Tubalord11 said:

He’s so freaking good. I’m a pianist myself and played the piece in 6th grade and lm tell you, it ain’t easy. But it’s so beautiful and delicate and he played it perfectly!! I remember freaking out with my mom when we got to see y’all at Wylie bc she’s the one who wanted me to learn the song in the first place, he played it so well every time! 

It’s awesome to see kids like that come into a program. 

[Percplayer19]

I was so glad to see Richland make finals and place 9th. It just verified the successful path the directors have been taking to get our program moving up. Last year was a promising success with this year just amazing. The wins for BOA Regional champion and USBands Burleson champion were not looked at by others as enough to consider Richland in State conversation’s but we trusted the directors that the early win’s verified the show was good early in the season and by the time Area came the band would be ready. I love when bands like Richland and Roma break into the mix with the larger bands and I admire their directors to get the most of their kids to be successful. Look forward to next season for Richland band. Also shout out to Area F bands for the success this area is turning heads. The competition was wonderful and look forward to seeing more improvements in this area.

[DukeDirtfarmer]

On 11/8/2023 at 1:35 PM, BandDad4Life said:

While driving back from San Antonio last night I started thinking about numbers. How many bands with 200+ kids vs those with less than 200. I found the results interesting. 

Number of 5A schools in Texas - 251.

The smallest band to compete - Liberty Hill HS with 120. 

The largest bands to compete - Aledo HS and Lebanon Trail HS with 238 each. 

The 5A State Champion Cedar Park HS with 237. 

Out of 35 schools to compete in prelims, 12 had 200+ while 23 had less than 200. 

The 12 schools to compete in finals, 8 had 200+ while 4 had less than 200. 

The top 5 schools had 200+. Burleson Centennial HS finished 6th as the highest ranked school with less than 200. Richland HS was the second one at 9th.

this means 8 of the top 10 had 200+ students in the band.

What does this all mean?  Nothing most likely but it definitely appears that having a larger band helps. No matter what size, it’s all about who performs their show the best. This year, it was Cedar Parks HS. 

Congratulations to Cedar Park and everyone else who got to perform at the SMBC!

I 100% agree. Rock Hill in 6A only had 150 kids this year with Walnut Grove opening a year early. No doubt it had an effect especially at Areas.

[RRBND27]

On 11/8/2023 at 7:16 PM, BandDad4Life said:

Another factor is money. Most of these schools have huge budgets and are able to buy everything. The smaller schools have a way smaller budget and piecing things together to have a show. Half a million dollar budgets and higher just blows 

Exactly!!!!! I've been saying this all along! Big facts! If you are out here in the DFW metroplex then know about the the Friscos, Prospers, Lewisville, etc.

They've built so many new schools literally a few miles from each other and converted what could've been 2 or 3 6A schools to making them all 5A smh ( Frisco ISD ) 

Lebanon Trail, Wakeland, Lonestar? 😲 3 out of the 251 schools from the same district in the 5A State Championship finals? So unreal.

Money talks .. MONEY absolutely talks for sure!! 🎯

[clarinetistkai05]

10 minutes ago, RRBND27 said:

Exactly!!!!! I've been saying this all along! Big facts! If you are out here in the DFW metroplex then know about the the Friscos, Prospers, Lewisville, etc.

They've built so many new schools literally a few miles from each other and converted what could've been 2 or 3 6A schools to making them all 5A smh ( Frisco ISD ) 

Lebanon Trail, Wakeland, Lonestar? 😲 3 out of the 251 schools from the same district in the 5A State Championship finals? So unreal.

Money talks .. MONEY absolutely talks for sure!! 🎯

Forney raises their own money for shows because the funding we get is not so great. Most the money we get is from these fundraisers and we put the money towards making the season happen (uniforms, food, transportation, etc). What makes Forney Forney is the band program itself. We almost never talk about results, and the directors have instilled a you reap what you sow mindset into us. Also, Forney starts kids as early as 6th grade, and that’s why we have so many joining as well is because of this success.

 

Ultimately, it’s not just money, it’s what you do with the program that gets you to where you are.

[Spirit]

There’s been a lot of debate about big bands vs smaller ones, but honestly, it’s a formula with the right combination of things. Not all big bands are good. Even money to buy the best shows and equipment won’t work if you don’t build a successful program from the ground up that I believe quite frankly starts in the feeder schools. You can throw all the money in the world at a program, but size and money are not the be-all end-all, and do not automatically equal success. 
 

With that said, success definitely begets success. And you’ll have that when you have a fine arts department committed to building a program (and yes, willing to recognize the value in spending some money to do it), when your staff is willing to spend the effort in time and sweat equity to get there, when you’ve earned the support of the community, and when you are also able to attract and inspire your students to work hard to achieve. Then, success will come. 
 

Commitment + Staff + Hard work + Support + Money.  

[ClutchATX]

Frisco and Leander have very similar demographics. Tech heavy upper middle class. In other words, lots of "nerds" that played in band when they were in school that have money, time and resources to help and support. Lots of stay at home or work from home parents. 

The interesting about CP is that won a few state championships in football and other sports also, but somehow band is still what the cool kids do. Choosing between football/sports or band is a real dilemma for incoming freshman. 

[BandDad4Life]

8 hours ago, Spirit said:

There’s been a lot of debate about big bands vs smaller ones, but honestly, it’s a formula with the right combination of things. Not all big bands are good. Even money to buy the best shows and equipment won’t work if you don’t build a successful program from the ground up that I believe quite frankly starts in the feeder schools. You can throw all the money in the world at a program, but size and money are not the be-all end-all, and do not automatically equal success. 
 

With that said, success definitely begets success. And you’ll have that when you have a fine arts department committed to building a program (and yes, willing to recognize the value in spending some money to do it), when your staff is willing to spend the effort in time and sweat equity to get there, when you’ve earned the support of the community, and when you are also able to attract and inspire your students to work hard to achieve. Then, success will come. 
 

Commitment + Staff + Hard work + Support + Money.  

Well said. It’s a combination of several things to make a program successful. Having a supportive Fine Arts Dept. Hiring the best band directors. Giving them the budget to hire the best show designers and music arrangers. Trust me, you don’t want me doing any of that. I know nothing about music. Putting kids in uniforms that make them feel proud. Getting good equipment so they’re not using broken down used items. Starting to get the kids interested and playing well EARLY in middle school to help build up the program. But the most important thing is execution, no matter how big or small a band is. If you’re not playing or marching well, you won’t go far. 

[LostChoirGuy]

13 hours ago, RRBND27 said:

Exactly!!!!! I've been saying this all along! Big facts! If you are out here in the DFW metroplex then know about the the Friscos, Prospers, Lewisville, etc.

They've built so many new schools literally a few miles from each other and converted what could've been 2 or 3 6A schools to making them all 5A smh ( Frisco ISD ) 

Lebanon Trail, Wakeland, Lonestar? 😲 3 out of the 251 schools from the same district in the 5A State Championship finals? So unreal.

Money talks .. MONEY absolutely talks for sure!! 🎯

I'm not sure why you think making multiple 5A schools in the same district is a bad thing.  I can see how it bothers you from a competitive standpoint, but they do it for the quality of education the students are able to receive and the increased opportunities for each individual.  I would never call that a bad thing.

[Spirit]

14 hours ago, RRBND27 said:

Exactly!!!!! I've been saying this all along! Big facts! If you are out here in the DFW metroplex then know about the the Friscos, Prospers, Lewisville, etc.

They've built so many new schools literally a few miles from each other and converted what could've been 2 or 3 6A schools to making them all 5A smh ( Frisco ISD ) 

Lebanon Trail, Wakeland, Lonestar? 😲 3 out of the 251 schools from the same district in the 5A State Championship finals? So unreal.

Money talks .. MONEY absolutely talks for sure!! 🎯

I’m from Frisco, and have been since the boom started here around 2001. When we moved here there was exactly ONE high school, so there has been NO ‘conversion’ of schools to make them smaller. I would kindly ask you to not spread misinformation about a situation you know nothing about. Frisco made a decision from the get-go that we wanted a ‘smaller’ school model, and we have continued to maintain that since the start. It gives our kids far more opportunities to participate in things, and there’s absolutely NOTHING whatsoever wrong with wanting that. 
 

Frisco ISD isn’t the only school district with three high schools in finals. There is another school district that has fielded three bands in finals, and that district usually ends up sweeping the medals. Why are you focusing your ire at Frisco?? Why is there any ire at all for any program?? 

[MelloMan06]

2 hours ago, Spirit said:

I’m from Frisco, and have been since the boom started here around 2001. When we moved here there was exactly ONE high school, so there has been NO ‘conversion’ of schools to make them smaller. I would kindly ask you to not spread misinformation about a situation you know nothing about. Frisco made a decision from the get-go that we wanted a ‘smaller’ school model, and we have continued to maintain that since the start. It gives our kids far more opportunities to participate in things, and there’s absolutely NOTHING whatsoever wrong with wanting that. 
 

Frisco ISD isn’t the only school district with three high schools in finals. There is another school district that has fielded three bands in finals, and that district usually ends up sweeping the medals. Why are you focusing your ire at Frisco?? Why is there any ire at all for any program?? 

As someone from an FISD Program I absolutely agree, we are lucky to have the funding that we do, but most/all schools have our own fundraising programs internally outside of district funding. Which we work for, and we work toward the goal of state finals. The smaller school model works for our district, and we all work extremely hard to get where we are.