UIL 6A Area B 2023

[LostChoirGuy]

6 hours ago, bancl said:

Music judge 2 putting Waxahachie in 8th overall and Keller 11th in brass.... I have some questions.  

The waxahachie one is baffling, but from what I've heard, there were some evident struggles in the brass opening fanfare for Keller that people have mentioned.  That judge might have been harsher about it.  I think it bodes well for them going into state because they are still improving and if they fixed that up they likely would have been ahead of at least Timber Creek here.

[littlejaw]

13 hours ago, bancl said:

Music judge 2 putting Waxahachie in 8th overall and Keller 11th in brass.... I have some questions.  

I can’t disagree with overall placements, but Keller 11th in brass (tied for last in finals) is baffling.

[BandDad4]

13 hours ago, Asaiah said:

Well... even though I personally disagree with that judge, it's worth noting that he's the Fine Arts Director for Leander ISD. So even though his opinion differs from mine, I trust that it's an informed opinion.

Fine arts director doesn't always mean they know anything about music. He might, but many don't as they come from theatre or educational backgrounds.

[Gehrig4]

If we dont stress about the actual placements, its really just comes down to who made it and who didn't.   And that conversation begins and ends with the 4 (berkner) and 12 (Carroll) ordinals in finals.    The rest of the bands were not really surprises.    (I suppose Central not making it was, but Haltom was very good - so someone had to sit.)

[BDC]

14 hours ago, Asaiah said:

Well... even though I personally disagree with that judge, it's worth noting that he's the Fine Arts Director for Leander ISD. So even though his opinion differs from mine, I trust that it's an informed opinion.

He has since retired.  Mike Howard is the Fine Arts Director for Leander ISD now.  just FYI. 

[BandGuy88]

22 hours ago, randomguardkid07 said:

very surprised about the mansfield schools placing as low as they did— and KC not making state!! loved their show so much. very happy for haltom though!

Saying this as a Mansfield ISD alum... I'm not necessarily surprised. There are really talented kids and teachers in MISD high schools but they are going up against schools with 1, 2, sometimes 3 (in the case of Coppell) more full time band directors than the Mansfield schools have.

 

When you have two "wind" directors for 170-200 (or more) wind players it becomes challenging for them to really address individual or section issues, so you rely lots on big picture "ensemble" teaching and hope the kids and leadership team are "self correcting". 

 

I could be way off but these are just my two cents

 

[emusketter]

14 hours ago, alex4nder said:

Would also like to mention that Haltom didn't even make area finals the last 2 years (13th in 2021 and 15th in 2022) so to end up 5th in prelims and 6th in finals is a pretty impressive turn around from the program. Especially in such a brutal area. 

Agreed. I think it is also worth mentioning that pre-Covid, 2019 Haltom had a very good year. And if I'm not mistaken, they were planning to attend GN in 2020. Haltom has a long and proud history dating to the 90s so it is nice to see them bring it back and hopefully continue it. 

[Asaiah]

1 hour ago, BDC said:

He has since retired.  Mike Howard is the Fine Arts Director for Leander ISD now.  just FYI. 

https://www.bandworld.org/WIBC/View.aspx?p=WIBCu_Warshaw

Oh, gotcha. I just googled his name and this popped up.

[randomguardkid07]

5 hours ago, BandGuy88 said:

Saying this as a Mansfield ISD alum... I'm not necessarily surprised. There are really talented kids and teachers in MISD high schools but they are going up against schools with 1, 2, sometimes 3 (in the case of Coppell) more full time band directors than the Mansfield schools have.

 

When you have two "wind" directors for 170-200 (or more) wind players it becomes challenging for them to really address individual or section issues, so you rely lots on big picture "ensemble" teaching and hope the kids and leadership team are "self correcting". 

 

I could be way off but these are just my two cents

 

i was more saying that i was surprised about lake ridge missing finals—their show wasn’t as strong as last year’s, but it was still impressive and felt finals-worthy. also, i feel that mansfield had a far better performance than they did last year, but they placed the exact same. i do agree with you, though, and i’m not discrediting your opinion at all!! just my two cents as well haha

[BandGuy88]

18 hours ago, randomguardkid07 said:

i was more saying that i was surprised about lake ridge missing finals—their show wasn’t as strong as last year’s, but it was still impressive and felt finals-worthy. also, i feel that mansfield had a far better performance than they did last year, but they placed the exact same. i do agree with you, though, and i’m not discrediting your opinion at all!! just my two cents as well haha

I hear ya and don't disagree. Other schools got better while the Mansfield schools sort of stayed where they were at last year. I still think if Mansfield ISD staffed the high school band programs like all the other districts in Area B we'd be seeing more schools make finals and possibly sneak into State, but again that's just my opinion. 

[Caleb02]

Does anybody have the prelims raw scores? I have seen the ordinals for prelims but am very curious to see the raw scores.

[aaron067]

[Caleb02]

56 minutes ago, aaron067 said:

Thank you!

[BandNerd07]

2 hours ago, aaron067 said:

Yeah, I wonder why they didn't post the raw scores on the UIL website this year...

[BandMom2026]

On 10/22/2023 at 10:42 AM, BandFanForever said:

The Fossil kids were super devastated and confused. They had a really good run at 8:30 in the morning, and they beat many of the bands that placed ahead of them earlier in the season. They just fielded their part 4 like the day before Prosper, and it was complicated, so maybe it still wasn't as clean as it needed to be? They were also sandwiched directly between LD Bell and Duncanville in prelims, so maybe their weaker areas looked even more obvious by comparison?? Who knows? All we can say is that there was a lot of shock and a ton of tears. Very sad. But congrats to the bands that advanced!! Great job!

Yeah they were.  If you look at the scores the judges were all over the place with Ridge.  One scored them 10 places ahead of another in music, and the visual judges did the same.  I can't agree with the scoring on Ridge at all.  They were definitely better than some of the bands that placed above them.  

[Tw6]

On 9/4/2023 at 9:05 AM, BandNerd07 said:

I thought it would be cool to post some band videos this year in this area. So here's a few I found:

Boswell HS: 

Chisholm Trail HS: 

Trinity HS: 

Lake Ridge HS: 

North Crowley HS: 

Fossil Ridge HS: 

 

You should check out the legacy bronco band

 

[Tw6]

On 10/22/2023 at 11:32 AM, randomguardkid07 said:

very surprised about the mansfield schools placing as low as they did— and KC not making state!! loved their show so much. very happy for haltom though!

Legacy and Mansfield placed higher than before. Legacy at 16 and Mansfield at 19. Suprised lake ridge got 13.

 

[BandFanForever]

5 hours ago, BandMom2026 said:

Yeah they were.  If you look at the scores the judges were all over the place with Ridge.  One scored them 10 places ahead of another in music, and the visual judges did the same.  I can't agree with the scoring on Ridge at all.  They were definitely better than some of the bands that placed above them.  

Yeah... the scoring was crazy all over the place. That's true of a lot of the bands.... wildly inconsistent scoring. I just watched a video of the performance with fresh, honest eyes and we watched a bunch of other bands that day, and while it may not have been enough to get into finals, the Fossil Ridge performance definitely did not deserve 23rd place by a long shot. Their performance was pretty great for as complicated as it was, and they had no tears, no guard drops, no collisions, no tech problems... it was a tiny bit dirty in parts, but overall pretty solid by the video. So confusing and heartbreaking for them. But it is what it is... judges preference, I guess.

[Linkus]

what were the thoughts on legacy's show overall?

 

[BandMom2026]

10 hours ago, BandFanForever said:

Yeah... the scoring was crazy all over the place. That's true of a lot of the bands.... wildly inconsistent scoring. I just watched a video of the performance with fresh, honest eyes and we watched a bunch of other bands that day, and while it may not have been enough to get into finals, the Fossil Ridge performance definitely did not deserve 23rd place by a long shot. Their performance was pretty great for as complicated as it was, and they had no tears, no guard drops, no collisions, no tech problems... it was a tiny bit dirty in parts, but overall pretty solid by the video. So confusing and heartbreaking for them. But it is what it is... judges preference, I guess.

They need a rubric or something.  It's next to impossible to advance unless you're a gigantic band.  Bands like Bowie and GP who are 6A schools, but not 6A size bands can't compete with bands like TC who have 4x the people.  The way UIL has always categorized size doesn't work in today's school system.  Bands should be categorized by program size not school size.  

Edited October 25, 2023 by BandMom2026
Original message wasn't clear.

[Gehrig4]

42 minutes ago, BandMom2026 said:

They need a rubric or something.  It's next to impossible to advance unless you're a gigantic band.  Bands like Bowie and GP who are 6A schools, but not 6A size bands can't compete with bands like TC who have 4x the people.  The way UIL has always categorized size doesn't work in today's school system.  Bands should be categorized by program size not school size.  

The other side of this argument is that the 6a designation already separates schools by size - the only way to do what you're saying is to do like football - 6a division 1 and 2.   Bands like Coppell have a full JV squad getting 1's at Area - TC graduates 46 seniors, but has like 90 freshmen..  they march 280-290  now so they are about to get much bigger.   Whether we like it or not, the bigger bands sound and look different.   I do think those legacy schools we all know, and the more frequent bands in ascent (Prosper, Wakeland, TC, e.g) deserve credit for building what they have.   We all know what a heavy lift it is.    Success begets interest begets success.    

[BandMom2026]

42 minutes ago, Gehrig4 said:

The other side of this argument is that the 6a designation already separates schools by size - the only way to do what you're saying is to do like football - 6a division 1 and 2.   Bands like Coppell have a full JV squad getting 1's at Area - TC graduates 46 seniors, but has like 90 freshmen..  they march 280-290  now so they are about to get much bigger.   Whether we like it or not, the bigger bands sound and look different.   I do think those legacy schools we all know, and the more frequent bands in ascent (Prosper, Wakeland, TC, e.g) deserve credit for building what they have.   We all know what a heavy lift it is.    Success begets interest begets success.    

Yes, they do look and sound different when they're larger which is why we should do it like Drill Teams do. They have small class, medium class, and large class.  You can't "beget success" when you can't compete because of your size.  It shouldn't be based on school size, it should be based on program size.  

[Asaiah]

If size dictates success, then how do bands like Rouse manage to be competitive with the larger bands?

[BandMom2026]

42 minutes ago, Asaiah said:

If size dictates success, then how do bands like Rouse manage to be competitive with the larger bands?

It doesn't necessarily "dictate", but it does make it extremely difficult.  Especially when it seems that almost all of the bands who go to state are very large.  Bowie and GP would have placed higher if they were with bands of similar size.  

[pancake]

2 hours ago, BandMom2026 said:

It doesn't necessarily "dictate", but it does make it extremely difficult.  Especially when it seems that almost all of the bands who go to state are very large.  Bowie and GP would have placed higher if they were with bands of similar size.  

what about Allen, they have the the largest band program in the nation but does not usually face competitive success. sure, having more kids would be very helpful, but it’s hard to make the assumption that bowie and gp would automatically place higher with more kids. i love bands like rouse and argyle as they are so amazing and manage to be amazing with a small number of kids, especially when competing with giant bands like round rock, vandegrift, and vista.